Carl Hedberg # 2

Jul 12, 2026 14:16 · 26:02 · English · STT.ai Enhanced · 4 المتكلمون
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0:00
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I remember you.
0:00
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And that's the only name
0:04
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I remember from the past.
0:06
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
As to who might have been assaulted,
0:09
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you mean, or what?
0:10
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yes,
0:11
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
because when they went through this whole kind of
0:15
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
BS when I,
0:16
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know, it's psychology 101,
0:19
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
but because I looked so much younger than I was at the time,
0:23
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I was 14,
0:26
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
but I probably looked,
0:27
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know, 11 or 10.
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S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I was very thin.
0:31
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Because of that,
0:32
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
the reaction from my parents was we must
0:36
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
shelter this poor wounded child after I came
0:40
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
down and told them what the guy had done and all that shit.
0:44
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And they tried to
0:48
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
shelter me by saying,
0:49
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
well,
0:50
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
it wasn't you.
0:51
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
There were two or three other boys who came forward this
0:55
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
week.
0:56
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Which was a total lie because,
0:57
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know,
0:58
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
it was just cause and effect.
0:59
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I go back and tell the story.
1:01
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
The police are called and he's huddled away the very next morning.
1:05
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
There was no way they could have learned about,
1:08
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know, some other boys came forward.
1:10
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
They were trying to,
1:10
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
it was just classic psychology.
1:14
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
trying to lessen the blow the the the idea that i might feel bad
1:18
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
that i turned someone in where where i was like no yeah i
1:22
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
just understood this is a this is a monster who needs to be stopped and
1:27
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
so i didn't take it um
1:29
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I didn't take it personally.
1:31
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah,
1:31
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
yeah. I didn't internalize it.
1:34
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah, well,
1:35
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you fortunately escaped,
1:37
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
which is a grand thing.
1:39
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Maybe that was because you're maybe a little older or more athletic that you
1:43
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
managed to escape.
1:44
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Well,
1:45
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
it's interesting because I think one of those,
1:48
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know,
1:49
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
some of it might be hard to read.
1:51
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I write very small sometimes.
1:55
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
But there is one of those is the story of that
1:59
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
day, all the memories I can remember.
2:01
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Oh really?
2:02
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Okay.
2:02
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
But I don't,
2:04
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
the gap is,
2:07
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know,
2:08
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
he told me to go in the,
2:10
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
let's go to the adult showers,
2:12
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know,
2:13
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
we're dirty from all our work,
2:15
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
which is, you know, I like bullshit.
2:18
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So he said,
2:19
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I'll meet you in the showers.
2:21
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So I went to my locker and got my swim trunks
2:25
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
on because I wasn't going to get naked in the shower with this
2:29
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
old fucker.
2:30
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And so then I went in the shower and he's
2:34
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
naked and he's under his shower and I'm under my shower.
2:37
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And he says,
2:37
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
will you wash my feet?
2:39
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Oh,
2:40
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Jesus.
2:44
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you washed my feet and so i you know and now now i'm kind of shaking a
2:48
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
little now i'm thinking i gotta get the out of here yeah and so i'm washing his feet and
2:52
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
i'm being grossed out and then he says look up and that's the view that
2:56
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
could never be oh jesus quite quite
3:01
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
impressive actually but uh the gap is i
3:06
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
do not know what i did at that moment
3:10
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
i think
3:12
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I might have just said,
3:13
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
this is too much,
3:14
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
or this, I have no idea.
3:16
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Maybe psychology could tell me what,
3:19
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I don't know.
3:20
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
But I do know that I remember
3:24
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
getting my bike and getting out the back door of
3:29
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
the gymnasium.
3:30
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
That's the one that,
3:32
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
the back door right near,
3:34
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
nearest the washrooms.
3:36
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So I just went,
3:37
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I had my...
3:39
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
thing and just just zipped right out exit stage left rick
3:44
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
so but i think that accounts in
3:48
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
there if you can read it it's some of it's hard to read but it'll give you an idea
3:52
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
If you have any questions,
3:54
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
that'd be fine.
3:55
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Okay, I don't know that I will have any questions.
3:57
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I was sort of more interested just to see,
4:00
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
because you were the one lucky one to escape,
4:02
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
so there's not really so much to report,
4:06
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
but I was more interested,
4:06
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
are you aware of anyone else who might have been,
4:10
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
let's say,
4:11
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
assaulted or others by anyone?
4:14
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
No,
4:15
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
the only name I ever heard was Hugh Jessamine,
4:18
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
but...
4:19
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
But that is my recollection from
4:23
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
50 years ago.
4:25
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Right.
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S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So I have no direct idea of
4:30
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
what the school did say.
4:32
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I thought the school did say a couple of K after
4:36
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
that letter was sent.
4:37
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
They found a couple more.
4:38
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah.
4:39
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Oh, they did.
4:40
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
The school said that.
4:40
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
They said it to you or they said it,
4:44
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know.
4:45
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
You know your law firm.
4:47
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah.
4:48
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
In one of those shots I sent you,
4:51
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
there's my exchange.
4:53
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I didn't remember,
4:55
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
but I have an exchange with your law firm.
4:57
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Okay, okay.
4:58
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Will Hannum.
5:00
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Will Hennam?
5:00
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah.
5:02
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Okay.
5:04
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Right.
5:05
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Okay.
5:05
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
That's not my law firm.
5:06
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
That's Dexter's law firm.
5:07
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Oh,
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S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
okay. So, yeah.
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S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So that's,
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S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
yeah. Yeah.
5:11
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Okay.
5:12
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Interesting. Yeah.
5:13
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I'll read through that.
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S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Great.
5:14
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Because I speak with a few people like Andre
5:18
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Stark and other people at Dexter.
5:20
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
How's Andre doing?
5:22
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Well, I had dinner with him at the Harvard Club three weeks ago.
5:28
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
We had a great time.
5:30
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I listened to all his stories and telling
5:34
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
him my stories.
5:35
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And I never brought this up,
5:38
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
but I did mention it to him the next day.
5:39
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Then we had some more conversations.
5:41
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
But no,
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S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
he's doing good.
5:42
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
He's been writing,
5:43
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
doing films,
5:45
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
and shorts and stuff.
5:49
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And so it was interesting.
5:51
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I hadn't seen him in a long time.
5:52
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
But he mentioned that...
5:54
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
There was a guy named Kenneth Little,
5:56
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
a teacher there,
5:57
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
who was also weird.
6:00
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
He told me lots of things.
6:01
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
He told me that Alan Edwards was one of the kids who had
6:06
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
gone to Europe with Ferguson as their sort of chaperone,
6:11
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
because the president...
6:14
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah, exactly.
6:15
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And then my brother who was in your class,
6:19
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
he also told me that Alan Edwards told him in the playground one time that Ferguson
6:23
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
had assaulted him.
6:26
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So I just have a number of course,
6:29
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know,
6:30
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
confirming people that...
6:33
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Alan,
6:33
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
who was the guy in my class who
6:37
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
committed suicide at Harvard?
6:40
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And revealed that he was gay.
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S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Who was that one?
6:44
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Prince.
6:45
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Alan Prince.
6:46
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Alan Prince,
6:48
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
really?
6:49
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Look into that name because I might be totally wrong.
6:53
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I mean, this is just...
6:54
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
But I had heard that he committed suicide at Harvard and that he was being
6:58
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
persecuted for being gay.
7:00
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
But Alan Prince might have certainly been one of the ones
7:05
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
who was
7:09
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
a victim.
7:09
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Interesting because...
7:12
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Interesting, because I looked up at,
7:14
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I got my list of all from my class of 1975.
7:18
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And there was a person who was missing on the list.
7:21
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So I was like,
7:23
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
wow, what happened to him?
7:24
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So I did some investigation on Google,
7:27
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
etc. And I came up and I found his obituary.
7:29
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
He died at the age of 49.
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S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And I couldn't,
7:33
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I was like, wow,
7:34
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Jesus, why would that be?
7:35
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
This guy,
7:36
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Charles Billings,
7:37
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
he was, he was a little bit effeminate.
7:41
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Did you?
7:42
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Oh yeah,
7:43
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I knew him.
7:44
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Didn't I?
7:46
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Was he in my class?
7:48
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
No, he was in my class.
7:49
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
He was small with glasses,
7:52
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
wasn't he?
7:53
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah, he had glasses.
7:54
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
He was thin.
7:54
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
He was a little bit effeminate.
7:56
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I remember him.
7:58
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
He was a good friend of mine.
8:00
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
He used to call me up.
8:00
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I was a musician.
8:01
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
He was a musician.
8:02
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I mean, he'd call me up.
8:04
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
We'd listen to music.
8:06
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And I wonder what happened to him because,
8:08
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know,
8:10
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
at that age, I didn't know much,
8:11
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
but I did sense he was very effeminate,
8:13
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know, not good at sports or anything.
8:14
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And I just wonder if he'd ever been anything.
8:18
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I remember he was kind of a kindred spirit because he got beat up too.
8:21
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah, we all got beat up.
8:23
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
The only,
8:26
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
the only,
8:27
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I was talking with.
8:31
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Glenn Darumple and he said he said he said the only problem with you guys is
8:35
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
that you start a fight with one of them then you got four four of them all over you
8:40
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And we were four brothers who went there.
8:43
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And when we
8:47
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
weren't fighting with the Dexter lads,
8:48
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
we were fighting with ourselves.
8:50
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Just like my family,
8:52
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
that's funny.
8:53
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah.
8:53
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Fortunately,
8:55
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
all that stopped when we turned 18 and we started drinking.
8:58
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Then the good times began.
9:02
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
But I was more calling you today just to,
9:06
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
first of all,
9:08
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
to thank you for all the information you've given and see
9:12
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
if there's anything that you might remember about other students who
9:16
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
might have been...
9:18
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Alan Prince came to mind,
9:20
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
but he's gone.
9:22
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
He's gone.
9:23
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Was there a person named Cortis in your class,
9:27
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
might you remember?
9:27
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Gary Curtis.
9:29
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Gary Curtis?
9:31
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I think so.
9:31
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I heard he committed suicide,
9:33
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
too.
9:34
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
He was a small kid,
9:36
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
too.
9:36
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah.
9:39
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I think I heard that he went to Nobles
9:44
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
after Dexter,
9:44
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
and then he had some problems,
9:46
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
and then he had...
9:47
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah,
9:47
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
he committed suicide.
9:48
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I was actually trying to contact him.
9:50
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
It's funny.
9:52
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I went to Dexter to get photographs of all the plaques
9:57
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
in Fisk Hall.
9:57
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Oh,
9:59
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
yeah.
10:00
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So because I noticed from my list of my class that some students
10:04
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
were missing.
10:04
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And also Alan Edwards' name was missing from the class of 72.
10:08
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So I noticed that there were,
10:10
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
and I didn't know whether it was because they were deceased or what,
10:14
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
but clearly some were deceased and some were not deceased.
10:16
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I don't think Alan is.
10:18
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I think he's still alive.
10:19
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
But clearly the names have,
10:22
S… Speaker 3 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know,
10:22
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
don't stack up with actually who was there.
10:25
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So I went to get photographs of the plaques.
10:29
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And all the plaques,
10:30
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
they're not there.
10:31
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
All the plaques from 1965 to 1976
10:36
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
are missing.
10:38
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
The only plaque that was there was from my
10:42
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
class, 1975.
10:43
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I guess I needed to make room for,
10:47
S… Speaker 3 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know,
10:48
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
2010,
10:48
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
11,
10:49
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
12.
10:50
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And that's true.
10:51
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
There was some,
10:52
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
but there still was free space for,
10:53
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I mean.
10:54
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
If they're in the teacher's lounge or something.
10:57
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah, that could be.
10:58
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I will probably check up next there.
11:01
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Next time I'm back in Boston.
11:03
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I don't know when that might be,
11:04
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
if I'm back in Boston.
11:07
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I may go back to sort of finish.
11:10
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I'm just doing some fact -finding to find out what happened,
11:15
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
sort of what went on at the thing.
11:18
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
But I guess one of the things you could tell me about is,
11:22
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
if it's not in your notes,
11:23
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
which I'll read later,
11:24
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
but so your father and your parents accosted
11:28
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Mr. Finney,
11:29
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
did they,
11:30
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
at some point,
11:32
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
and said, hey,
11:33
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
what's going on?
11:37
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I don't recall any of that they said anything to Finney.
11:41
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Oh, so they just called the Brooklyn Police Department or something?
11:44
S… Speaker 4 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I think so.
11:45
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Right.
11:46
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I don't think they got in Mr.
11:49
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Finney's face about it at all.
11:51
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I don't recall that.
11:52
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
He was a...
11:55
S… Speaker 4 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I mean,
11:56
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
we saw him as a real gentleman.
11:58
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Real soft -spoken type of guy who seemed kind
12:03
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
and gentle.
12:03
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I think the idea was,
12:05
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
let's just call the police.
12:07
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And I'm just wondering that that's probably their idea.
12:10
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Okay.
12:11
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And did you witness any of that,
12:13
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know, the police scene or anything?
12:14
S… Speaker 4 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Or, I mean,
12:15
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
did you actually go there?
12:16
S… Speaker 4 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
No,
12:18
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
it was as,
12:19
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
and this is another view that cannot be unseen.
12:23
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
As the Dexter bus was pulling
12:27
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
up the hill,
12:28
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
he lived in,
12:31
S… Speaker 4 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
remember where Mr.
12:33
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Tilsley used to live?
12:34
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I know the name,
12:35
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
yeah.
12:36
S… Speaker 4 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And remember when Mr.
12:37
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Kilsley gave us the instructions on cars,
12:40
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
like how to change tires?
12:42
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
That was the apartment.
12:44
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
It's from the
12:49
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
new...
12:50
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yep.
12:53
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So it's up on the hill.
12:55
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So the bus pulls in and
13:00
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
goes along the...
13:01
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
It just banks right.
13:05
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
There's a straight that'll take you around to the main
13:09
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
building.
13:11
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
But then there's a left,
13:12
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
which takes you to the ring.
13:13
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Right there,
13:15
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
because we're lower than that hill,
13:17
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
the apartment area probably had three
13:22
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
police cars with the lights going.
13:24
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Wow.
13:25
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah,
13:27
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
there were a couple other vehicles.
13:28
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
But the area was basically packed.
13:30
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So there was definitely a police
13:34
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
response.
13:35
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And I was the only one.
13:37
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
The whole bus was like,
13:39
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
wow, look,
13:39
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I wonder what's going on.
13:40
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I was just sitting there going,
13:42
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I know exactly what's going on.
13:42
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I know what's going on.
13:45
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
No, I didn't say anything.
13:47
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And because you mentioned in one of your emails
13:51
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
to me that they had found a treasure trove or a mountain of child porn.
13:56
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And I was wondering how you came about that.
13:58
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Was there some police report that produced and they gave to you or something?
14:02
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
No, this would have been hearsay through filtered,
14:05
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
which I suspect would filter down from at
14:10
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
the time I was there.
14:11
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Both his kids were attending
14:15
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Dexter.
14:16
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Ferguson had two kids attending Dexter?
14:19
S… Speaker 4 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
No,
14:20
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Mr.
14:21
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Finney.
14:21
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Oh, Mr.
14:21
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Finney. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
14:22
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Than was in my class.
14:23
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
It was Robert and Than.
14:24
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Nathaniel,
14:25
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
yeah.
14:26
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah, they were both attending.
14:27
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So I assume that any rumors came down through,
14:31
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
filtered down through their classes and then into our classes.
14:35
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Right.
14:36
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Through them.
14:36
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Because I never,
14:39
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
it was,
14:40
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
there was never a police report.
14:41
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
We never spoke of it again in our family.
14:44
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
It just kind of blew away.
14:45
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And then...
14:49
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
It must have just been through the,
14:51
S… Speaker 4 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know,
14:52
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
the scuttlebutt that I heard that there was child pornography found
14:56
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
and that his wife was...
15:00
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Heartbroken and shocked.
15:01
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
She was just in...
15:04
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And this may have come from parents,
15:07
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
through my parents.
15:09
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
My stepmother,
15:11
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Betsy, might have relayed that information to me.
15:15
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
It's possible.
15:16
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Because I'm sure that some of the parents must have known.
15:19
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah,
15:21
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I don't know.
15:22
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Possibly,
15:24
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
but I guess at that point,
15:25
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
they probably wouldn't want to disseminate that type of information to too many people.
15:31
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Right.
15:31
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I think,
15:32
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
so it's interesting.
15:34
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So the other student,
15:36
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know,
15:37
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Alan Edwards, he was,
15:38
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
that happened in Europe.
15:40
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So when that finished,
15:42
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
he came back and his parents then told Mr.
15:46
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Finney about it.
15:47
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So it's a strange thing because,
15:50
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know, they came back and Alan Edwards' parents told Mr.
15:54
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Finney. So Mr.
15:54
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Finney removed Ferguson from his teaching role,
15:58
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
but he was still there at the campus.
16:03
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And that's when my younger brother recalls the peak
16:07
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
of the assaults against him.
16:10
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So my younger brother was groomed and assaulted over a
16:14
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
regular basis from 70 to 71.
16:16
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And so that's,
16:17
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
but he records that the peak of it was in spring.
16:20
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So effectively he was terminated in January of 71,
16:23
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
but still stayed there until June.
16:28
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Then it seems that your brother has a case for
16:32
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
a lot more than apology.
16:34
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah.
16:35
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
He was kicked out twice.
16:36
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Once he was,
16:37
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
he left,
16:38
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
he stayed there.
16:39
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And the next time when I was involved,
16:41
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
he was out.
16:42
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah.
16:42
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Cause I,
16:43
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I think,
16:44
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
I think when,
16:45
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
when you came,
16:46
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
well, you say,
16:46
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
we don't really know,
16:47
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
but you say roughly spring of 71,
16:48
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
which is what the lawyer said,
16:50
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
um, that sort of fits in.
16:52
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So the second red flag was raised.
16:54
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Um,
16:54
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
right.
16:55
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And so,
16:56
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
because your brother was.
16:58
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
was assaulted in between the red flags.
17:01
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah, and after,
17:03
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
and after,
17:04
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
until June.
17:06
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah. That's just crazy.
17:35
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
brother was uh because he was one year behind me uh and so
17:39
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
that effectively gave him a free reign you know he had no classes to teach
17:43
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
and and um
17:49
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Yeah, I have a document that says that
17:53
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
he resigned in June of 71.
17:55
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
That was from the Dexter annual yearbook.
17:58
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So he resigned in 71,
18:01
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
even though their lawyers tell me he was terminated.
18:04
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
And so it's got two different,
18:08
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
you know.
18:10
S… Speaker 2 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
You have to save face.
18:11
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
Exactly.
18:12
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
They have to save face.
18:17
S… Speaker 1 (Carl Hedberg # 2)
So I'm not sure we have a story.

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