Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26

0:00

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

ASDAM stands for Australian Southern Defense and Defense Manufacturing. The reality is the majority of our company is not any of those things. So we're in America, not Australia. We do not do defense, we do commercial. So there's, and TAE no longer manufactures. I'm not going to do this anymore. Oh, it's okay. So our business is now Aero Engines.

0:25

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

and components. So in Australia we do wheels and brakes for Qantas, for Jetstar, for their fleet, because we also look after and pop the fence with wheels and brakes. But nowhere else are we in the business of doing wheels and brakes. It was just a business to pop the fence in Australia when we did promotion. Because we're XA New Zealand, when we used to be owned by New Zealand. So our business and focus nowadays is predominantly engines.

0:52

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

On my side, on the military side of the business, the F-135 for the J-Boats of the United States government. So the model for the F-35 is one that is a global model. So your aircraft you do not own. When you fly it, you own it. The minute the part comes off, it belongs to this global pool, like a rental car.

1:18

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

When an engine comes off an Australian aircraft, for example, let's say it was a bird strike to the fan, they take the fan off, there's three modules on an F-35, the fan, the power and the augmenter. They get another one, they bolt it on, they bolt it in the airframe, no tests out, they test it, they go fine.

1:37

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

That fan module will go to one of five shops in the world. TAE in Australia, IHI in Japan, Komsberg in Norway, in the Netherlands in Standard Aero, and the US Air Force in Oklahoma City. The US Navy is setting up a facility, so they will have one as well in Jacksonville, so there will be six of us.

1:59

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

So what happens in the future is as a module comes off, it gets shipped to one of the six shops, we fix the module, and then the module will go somewhere in the world. It could be to Italy, it could be to Singapore, it could be to... it's a big pool.

2:13

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

All of our other engines belong to an Air Force or a Navy. So the 414 engine for the Super Hornet we do directly for the Australian Air Force. Here in Malaysia obviously we do the 404 module for the Malaysian Air Force. Because Australia doesn't fly the classic Hornets anymore, we made the decision...

2:41

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

because I'm growing in Australia to bring the tooling from Australia and the knowledge and set up our 404 shop here in Malaysia. So we finally got our facility. We've been spending time with the landlord to lease our facility. We started our training and hiring of Malaysian staff. They will come to Australia, they will learn the modules and then we will gradually shift the module work here.

3:06

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

What we have no intention of doing is setting up repair capabilities in Malaysia. There's already many companies that can offer those services and it's in our interest what we want to do is partner with Malaysian companies to be able to do repairs for components. So a lot of specialist repairs, not because of just the equipment, it's the knowledge, the engineering and the morale. It takes a long time to teach that.

3:33

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

And to be honest, we don't need to teach if there's people that can do the work for us as a subcontractor. So the first step for us after Fred met with AirRod was to get you added to our TAA so that we're able to share technical F-18 data with AirRod. So that's in getting authorised by the US State Department. Because of their funding...

4:02

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

President of America keeps not funding their bills, so the government shuts down. Every time the government shuts down, there's no public servants, no work gets done. So we hope within the next two to three months they will sign the TAA. Once we get that back, then we can share the data and Mr Aiken.

4:21

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

can give, here's all of the components you'd like with the repairs, here's the repairs, are you able to do it? If not, how can we work together to set up that capability for you to be able to do those repairs for us? And of course how much. And of course how much. The next piece that for some of those repairs we would like to look at, because at the moment for our 414 engines,

4:45

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

in Australia, we have to send parts either to America or to other places to get fixed. If we can, and it's after we do the 404, but if some of the repairs are similar repairs, because obviously GE engine, similar components.

5:00

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

We would also like, and we have to work with GE on this, but I'm planning to look at this, to look at how we can have some of those parts repaired in Malaysia. So that would be Australian parts that we shipped to Malaysia to be repaired, shipped back to Australia to fit to engines. We approach GE Malaysia because they can do the work, but GE Malaysia does not want to do any defence work, I mean civilian engines, they don't want to. And that's just a GE thing, it's not anything else.

5:27

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

So that's really where we are from the military side of our business. Obviously, we're aware we have our TPE331 business, the Honeywell engine business. We are now the world's largest 331 business.

5:44

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

And that's just because everything else is shrinking. We have a lot of parts. That's what enables us to keep going. We bought a lot of parts four years ago from Honeywell. We bought parts at a price that was a lot cheaper than you now buy from Honeywell. So our US facilities in Scottsdale and Idaho do our 331 work in the US. Up until very recently, they did probably three quarters of the engine work.

6:10

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

But our Adelaide shop now does a lot of work because of the tariffs. Canada, for example, they ship us PT6s from Canada to Adelaide because they don't want to go into America for the tariff.

6:23

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

So that's our commercial business. I don't look after the commercial business. Arthur is the person that looks after the PT6 and 331 business. But in that area, they do mainly commercial customers, but they do look after a couple of military customers that operate Dorniers and other aircraft, but obviously I think the civilian side of them.

6:47

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

And then we can do fuel controls and accessories for business. The other part of our business is the AGT, which is where there's only two engine shops in the world that can do that engine. It is the gas turbine in the back of the Abrams tank. So there's ourselves in the US Army are able to do that work. Poland is setting up capability and in three years should have its capability to look after. Obviously they have an adversary on there.

7:17

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

the border that they want to be able to defend from.

7:24

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

So hopefully that gives a very quick overview of where TA is and what we are doing. So basically you are presenting more on the military side? Yeah, that's the military side. And the PT6 is on the commercial side? Correct. So PT6 is for us, it's the only engine where we are not aligned with the OEM. So on the PT6 side for very good reasons.

7:52

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

We made the decision and we've been offered a number of times to become a DOF. But the problem is that Pratt-Riddy Canada still requires any PMA parts in the engine to be removed when it is in your shop. All of our customers would go away if we enforced that rule. All of our customers have PMA parts in their engines.

8:12

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

pratt require any doff if the engine comes in even if you are only fixing two fan blades and use the compressor has a pma part you must pull apart the whole engine take out the pma part put in a pratt part and charge the customer oh you can imagine what would happen if we offered that to our customers yeah so um so we have a pratt whitney certified tesla in the us and so they still will do that for money

8:36

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

So they qualify and certify our Tesla. We buy all our publications from Pratt-Whitney. We still buy a lot of parts from Pratt-Whitney that we can't get PMA, but we have PMA. For all of our other engines, we are aligned to the OEM. GE, Pratt-Whitney and Hummington. It's the only one.

8:52

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

But we have full overhaul capability in both Arizona and in Adelaide. Hot section type work we do in a lot of places but to be honest that's mainly driven by our customers where they want that help and support and most of the customers we do hot section for.

9:14

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

are airframe maintenance companies that are doing the whole airframe. They ask, can you come, you do the hot section, it's part of the lane where they sign up. There is a couple of militaries we do, I think, Nepal, a couple in South America, I can't remember which, Colombia, a couple of South American countries, because obviously we're in America, and we have field service teams that do a lot of work in South America for customer advice.

9:46

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

Predominantly agricultural customers in the north of America and in Australia, it's all crop busters.

10:00

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

firefighting aircraft in America and then transporters, new transporters. So a lot of our TPE customers are also our PT6 customers and in some cases where they get rid of their old aircraft and they buy new aircraft.

10:16

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

On our part here, we are one of the companies called the AROD Group. AROD Group comprises of AROD itself, that specialises in the marrow of the free slide that leads to other types of products like that. Covering both commercial and civil.

10:42

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

variant of CMA. And for us here, we do, we do engine, and we do only two types of engine. One is the T56 engine, both military and civil version. The other one is P56A, which we are just started to get the job for process manufacturers. The other category is the commercial.

11:24

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

So my team here is looking at the Indian team and we would like to attend.

11:31

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

for giving the chance to get some job with you involving AB Liner and DT to support you. So we have a tech shop that you support. We are very thankful to them that you will give the customers to work with you. And now that we have a very specific mission here involving the 56 environment.

12:11

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

At the moment, we will find very difficult to...

12:23

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

Does the Air Force require an approval from Pratt & Ritten? Do they need it? They have a lot of money for nothing. Because you can buy the publications, you do not have to be an improved shop.

12:52

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

So basically how we undertake the work for our customers is...

12:58

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

We buy the manuals from Pratt & Whitney and you pay each year for the manuals, so we have the publications. You can get trained Pratt & Whitney people, you can send them to the courses there or you can get from industry because it's so big. Parts, parts you can buy from many suppliers. Some parts you can only get from Pratt & Whitney, depends on which dash model engine it is. The issue with the PC21s is more pilates.

13:21

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

or PC-12. Pilatus have tried more and more and more to bring back that they do everything and they send to Switzerland and Ruag does the engines. But many times I've spoken to Ruag about it. In a lot of cases they don't want to do some of those engines. It's not all business for them. It's not big volumes. So Pilatus does create a lot more of the problem if they sign the deal and they say you must be cracked. What we've convinced our customers is

13:50

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

in a lot of cases the pma parts are better because they were designed afterwards very good engineering they're a lot cheaper and now because the age of the engine they've got proven life all those manufacturers can prove to you that their life is real so it's really a scenario of the difficulty convincing the air force

14:12

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

is because they're so used to hearing must be, for example, TV6 must be Rolls-Royce approach. And in some engines, that is the only way you can do it because it's the only way you can get data, the only way you can get parts. But on the PD6, very different. The best way is not to be OEM aligned. As in, not forcing must be practically parts. That is the best solution for the customer in money and in supply.

14:38

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

Because the problem with the parts that are only Pratt & Whitney, Pratt & Whitney doesn't make a lot of those, they're not Pratt & Whitney, they don't make a lot of those parts because there's so much competition. So if you are only Pratt & Whitney, we have had customers come to us that were going to the Pratt & Whitney shop, but their engine was there for three months. Their engine was there for three months, they were waiting for a part.

15:00

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

I have the part of my shop PMI I could like to market. So it is one of those engines that there are so many PMI manufacturers, particularly in the States, that are FAA approved. So that's an FAA certified part. So all of our engines that leave our shops, be it America or Australia, are either leaving with an EASA certification, an FAA certification, for Indonesia, maybe Indonesia, Japan, it's JAL. Depends which country you want certification they want.

15:26

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

But that is the certification that says this engine is good to fit to your aircraft.

15:53

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

so that will be the alternative so-called alternative oh yeah yeah correct correct and if you want sovereign capability and country yeah so let's say we hear from the bottom now you do have to really get that you have to really rely on that you have to buy the manuals from them and you pay for that but it is not stupid and the test cell you must correlate but that is easy the two things that i

16:37

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

if you want the patent certificate yeah so if you want the patent certificate you pay and they come and certify your tesla yeah but

16:49

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

We have designed and built both of our test cells ourselves. That's what we used to do. We don't do a lot of test cells anymore because our business is busy doing a lot of other things. But in essence, there are companies that can do that for you. Ctech in the United States. We can help.

17:23

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

We would have to probably talk to Pratt because...

17:27

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

What you don't want is that they don't certify. So you want to be able to show that you have a system, but I think Pratt would often train people. No problem. They train people. They have no problem teaching people. You would want at least a couple of Pratt-trained people because it is good for your shop when you see Air Force that you can show this person was trained in the Pratt-Wittman facility. Oh, Mr. Peoples. Oh, Mr. Peoples.

17:57

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

Yeah, it's a company. But they are certified. It's a company. It's a training. Mr. 56. Mr. 56. Yeah. Mr. 56. Yeah. It sounds like it's a joke, but it's actually a joke. Oh, right. Oh, yeah, that's good. So I think they have trained people before. Yeah, they've trained out for it. The credits, the medals, the calories of the medals. It's not a problem.

18:32

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

You just pay the fee each year and you get the latest publication. And it's all digital, so it's like a software rental account. It just automatically updates. It's easy.

18:58

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

So we can we can help we can help and Mr. Reyes a lot more experienced at building test cells than I am. And I've seen it. And he's been to your site. It's basically building a new one.

19:15

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

Other than parts of the engine. There's not much else there. It's your engine test, your bed, and your dining. The rest is your excellent...

19:30

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

So if you wanted a dyno one, we could do the interface with your existing cooling tower. What we are happy to show is we can get a video of our one in the States, which is the newer Tesla, PD6 Tesla, and then the one in Adelaide. But they're both dyno. They're both dyno. So because for the larger engine, we need a dyno.

19:58

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

so they're on the tip

20:00

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

We test on a dyno in Adelaide. I never recommend because in the US we test on ProcStan. It's a lot easier to test on ProcStan because of the pulse patient.

20:14

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

Once you have been awarded the contract to maintain the cap-cell and purpose used for HEPO for GDP. And along with it is the column for ACP. Correct. And we would like to be appointed as beneficiary to this project. For example, what can you offer if the UPGR is appointed to this beneficiary? So that we can propose this to our project.

20:49

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

we are we are new to icp and mr right so right now yes we've covered our first one but as we grow all the tooling and equipment and all that stuff in all honesty then there's there's two things that we want to achieve and the icp is really just a measure we want to be doing

21:10

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

all of our work in Malaysia for Malaysia. And the reason for that is no different to the same thing with your voice. The more we can do here in Malaysia, the more we can support the Malaysians to be self-sufficient. Talking to Thailand today, hearing that America turned off their parts, their whole fleet is crowned, over one thing of a clone port.

21:31

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

You cannot have, you know, as an Australian, it is very important. Malaysia is very strong to protect me and my family because Malaysia has to be strong for me to be safe. So the reality is that what we want to do is to be able to work with Malaysian companies to grow in country capability. So should we ever need it, the Malaysian Air Force should always be able to fly. It doesn't matter what their relationship is with America or others, they should be able to fly.

22:07

S… Speaker 3 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

So we've already listed ATP as an ICP.

22:31

S… Speaker 3 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

and we've already put you on the tab, okay? And you can remember some of the silly questions I had to ask, right?

22:45

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

we know the answer but yeah but you still have to ask it efficiently anything that you think they've got a lot more experience and we've got another

23:14

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

in the program or activity.

23:18

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

So we can look at, so I think what would be very useful is, we're not, we have PT6 experts in our business, I'm not a PT6 expert, that's not my area, but I think what we can do is, I can talk to the Adelaide business and see how can we help you on your journey to have PT6 capability for the Malaysian essence inside of that process.

23:46

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

so it's um but happy to work with you to build that capability yeah correct Adelaide will want to be up and there may be things that you can also then as well for some of their customers in region that they may be interested in i'm not sure there's there's not a significant number of malaysian customers i think they work with indonesia we have some customers i know we have in thailand and others but in the philippines but it's

24:13

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

I'm sure they're happy to hop around and particularly around some of the component stuff. Because we have fuel control shops, we have all the accessories, we do a lot of work for other PT6 providers doing the fuel controls. Because the rigs are so expensive, a lot of people don't want to buy the rigs. So we're an authorized shop for PT6 controls.

24:38

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

But yeah, more than happy to help you out. I come in with a big hope actually, and as I see this now, Bremeny is capable of doing it. When you expect to be like, why did you have to rely on Bremeny? Only for PT6. All of the other engines, yeah, you really don't have choice. But because PT6 and because Pratt & Whitney know, they will...

25:00

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

They will sell anybody parts because they know the only way they're going to make money is sell parts. They will sell their manuals. So very rarely though, the problem we have come across is the same in Australia. The Australian Air Force will not send us Indians, even though we are a defence shop. Because Pilatus says must go back to Switzerland. The Air Force has come to us many times and said, can you do the engines here? He said, we can, but we're not a Pratt shop. There will be BMA parts.

25:27

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

Sometimes they find that very difficult to comprehend, but we share with them and say 60-70% of the world's PD6s do not go to a crack shop.

25:42

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

No, no, no, no. You pay Pratt Whitney per year and on your computer, automatic update. So all of our technicians, you subscribe, you pay per year. I don't know the exact cost. It's not a very big number, but that's what you pay for that. And for the certifying of the TESA, I think it's every three years. And their person comes out to our TESA, we...

26:07

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

We dual calibrate and away we go. We can, because we have the two test cells, we dual calibrate the two test cells at the same time too. The one in America and the one, we have the same control software. So we can cross correlate ourselves before we pay for them to come. So what that enables is before you pay for them to come, you know you will pass.

26:34

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

Because if you don't pass you have to play something to come back. Thank you very much for your willingness to help us.

26:57

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

With your knowledge and experience in T56...

27:06

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

When we were in New Zealand, we did T56, it's okay. So I know the T56 engine reasonably well, but with the business being able to have Rolls-Royce approval. Because our customer is a typical customer.

27:23

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

The truth is I wouldn't have even come for the plate-to-flame spray. Anything else? No. Do you know what to report to? Just one other thing though. When you pitch to the Air Force, it might be an idea to get a price of, say, a number of faults. They will never replace these decent planes, right?

27:52

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

and then compare that to the parts and the same price. That's how we go to our customers. So we say, you're going to pay this much for your engine overhaul at these levels if you go to a Pratt shop. This is how much you pay you come to us. So we can help with that because we know the prices of the engines and your labour cost is not the big issue, it's the parts. It's significant.

28:17

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

It is significant. And the parts are, the huge advantage is a lot of the PMA parts you can buy and have delivered in two days. And they have good life. So the beauty to your customer, all of our customers, we say we can have your engine in and out of our shop faster than any truck shop in the world.

28:43

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

And the beauty is, PMA parts don't just come out of America, they come out of Europe as well. So even if America shuts its doors, you can still get P26 PMA parts from Europe. And they're Canadian, but a lot of their parts do come out of America. So we hold parts in Australia.

29:07

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

The advantage of not being on DOS, we can sell parts too. So if you didn't have a part needed, you can call us, we can sell you a part. So that's, whereas with a DOS, we cannot, so for TP, I cannot sell you parts. They will not allow me. But for PD6, we can. And we do do a lot of that with other shops in the world, where if we can't get a part or we have a special part, we bring them, they ring us, we sell parts. Like commercial airline does with other airlines.

29:33

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

That makes sense. So what Mr Wright can help with, and our business, Arthur Gannis cooks after our business in Adelaide, but I'm sure that we will tell. Well, we did mention to him, unfortunately, he's been following up. We're trying to do what should be very simple, finalise our lease for our building, but...

30:00

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

Thank you very much. Thank you. Lovely to meet you. Thank you for your time. Thank you. Lovely to meet you. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. Good to see you again. Thank you. Thank you very much.

30:37

S… Speaker 2 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

We got a new road one.

31:07

S… Speaker 3 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

Amaryllis.

31:25

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

Okay, thank you very much. You'll see a lot of annoyance once I get those TIAs. I won't break the rules.

31:38

S… Speaker 1 (Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26)

Indian thing. Yeah. Where? Hmm? You got this Indian thing? Oh, you want to enter? You don't have to come and see me. You want to follow me? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Are you sure?

Minit of Meeting with TAE Australia 21apr26

Тұжырымдама

Бұл транскрипт туралы ДК- дан сұрау