Recording_154

0:00

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

The visitors here. I usually come over once a year at least. So, as I'm here, I thought it's... Yes, sure, sure. Thank you very much. You've been to Singapore to meet with Mr. Mohammed? No, I haven't been up to Singapore, no. Just Thailand. You come from Thailand? No, no, I went from Thailand back to London. I came from London here.

0:30

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

I've been to Greece in between as well. And then you came directly from London? I came directly from London. So we landed on Monday at 5.30am and then I think at 8 we had the first meeting, or maybe at 9. And then it was like boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. So travelling with Greece is amazing, but it's also very, very efficient. So I feel that it feels more like Olympics to me. But it's been... Something like marathon. Yeah, exactly.

0:58

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

But for me it's the first time in Bangladesh, the first time in Dhaka, the first time in Chicago. And I said to my colleagues that I came here without any kind of expectations. I was just told to Chris that there are very, very kind people.

1:16

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

So I had the picture painted, but then when I came here I think that... To a change or...? No, I mean, it's really amazing. I mean, the amount of kindness, openness, and hospitality that we have Matt, I think it's just incredible.

1:34

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

Thank you very much. Yes, you can certify because otherwise my energy would be low, but I feel it's still late in the day and I'm still kind of high, like on this high level of energy. It's just fantastic to meet all of you. Thank you. Do you know, do you have any news of the crew? I... Because I know Mohammed was going to speak directly with the lawyers Raj and Tam. Yeah, our ambassador.

2:04

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

from Thailand. They are trying to contact with Rajan Tan but they are not picking up the phone. I don't know why, what is the reason why they are not picking up. They call me two times. They should at least respond if we are working on it or not or something like that. I spoke to Rajan Tan and I said Mohammed will call you and I sent them a message and so they know he needs to speak to them. Yesterday I talked with their...

2:31

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

our foreign secretary as well. They said, no, Raja is not working, he's not picking up all of us. I said that he should, he should. Because they are working for us, they are working for PNA, they are working for the crew. Let me follow up on that when I get back to the hotel. Because they know this needs to be sorted out between the owners and Raja Tan without involving the club because of its...

2:58

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

If they're going to pay the police, that's something we don't want to get involved in. Friendly speaking, I told him from the very beginning, give something there in underhand and let them go. Can I ask if they tried to contact them after Friday? Because I think that we had our chat with Muhammad on Friday last week.

3:28

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

And then they tried to contact the lawyers after Friday, right?

3:37

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

Leave that with me, I'll chase them up when I get back to the hotel apparently Raj and Tal are not following up with Mohammed in relation to Korea which they need to I understand who will come by end of this month or who they want to keep my stuff That's the hook That's what they said, so yes, let me chase that when I get back

4:03

S… Speaker 3 (Recording_154)

Because that needs to be sorted out quickly.

4:35

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

Today I'm going to be... There was an election on last year. Big fighting. It took about, I think, one month or so. Really? So did you have to lobby hard? He went to high court even. Really?

5:12

S… Speaker 3 (Recording_154)

What is it involved? What do you have to do?

5:14

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

All the shipping agents. And you represent them with the government and the port? Everywhere, yes. What about Bangladesh? For me, I became the same man. I don't change myself. Now, after the ministry, I got the chance to meet with it. Yes, yes. Good to you.

5:42

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

Congratulations. Thank you. I heard you went to Amulcar. Indeed, we did. They're back on the ship owning. Yes, yes. They were the good ship owner actually in a time back. I don't know when they stopped in between. They said it became too expensive with all the ships for repairs. Yes, that's what I took. And the market was quite flat. So actually, they chartered so many vessels there. Yes.

6:08

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

And one of our vessels was under their chapter, you know the private piyasana. Was it? Yeah. But they spoke very highly. Yes, it was at Sancheon. Sancheon. Yeah, now it's Sancheon. Yeah.

6:23

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

They have taken away because they are the owner. Abul Khair also tried to make contact with us. They said, okay, you take enough of the vessel. I said, then what? After six months, one year, then you take back. You do the hard work. Yes. Same happening in front of yourself. They're a very powerful group, aren't they, Abul Khair? Yes.

6:53

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

Nice meeting we had actually. So I think we should formally record thanks to Tim and his team for an amazing job. We got the first notification. Saturday morning, 7 o'clock, three degree list. Marlena is six days into her Tizer's career. I'm thinking if she's clever, she's going to switch her phone off on Saturday morning. But she didn't. For me, when I hear, I remember the first notification.

7:23

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

And I've been dealing with casualties really the last 11 years. And when I hear that the vest is listening, then it's like... It is the second day, you know. Everything was quite okay, quite perfect. It was very cool. And we are planning for more better. Even I was in Malaysia. I was in Portland. I was in Portland and I just met with everyone.

7:52

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

Then morning time is okay? After departure, I came in. After departure, I came in. After departure, I came in. Suddenly, they got to serve. I said, what happened? Check your stability and everything. Everything is perfect. Then why it is this thing? Okay, then I said, okay, wait for half an hour, two hours. Every two hours, you just report. Then he said, sir, waste is not improving. It will have to be increasing, increasing, increasing. The water as well. Yes, it will be.

8:23

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

I've got a question to ask you as a non-technical. When they had the problem before they sailed, they had a little list, yeah? Yeah. And they took three containers off? No, no, no, no, no. Before sailing... Before sailing, there was a little list, they took some containers. Oh, in the port, in the port. They took four containers off.

8:42

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

Was that the right decision? Yeah, that was the right decision. You don't think they should have investigated the authority? No, no, no. I'm just talking now. I'm telling you what is the fact, actually. They, even they ditched some container, load it down below, then load on top, they can come. What they say, sir, I look already on board. What you do? I say, let the cargo behind it. Never mind, you go.

9:08

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

Then they have discharged three containers or four containers. Because I don't want to work for the pilot to stay there, unload and discharge, then again you go back. So the pressure was from the pilot to go? Yeah, that's what that is. So we said, let it go, even if this container is nothing for you. And they said, okay, we are staying here. I think they have taken back one container. It is not for anything, for...

9:40

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

I just wondered if with hindsight they should have done something different So they had a list they took four containers off

10:00

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

Once it is corrected, I said, you correct the things, then load on top, they said, no sir, pilot will not continue, stay here. Then we have to take second pilot. And I said, okay, then in that case, let it be like that, let it be hang, and it will be another positive also, positive GL also for you. So it, they said, okay, let's go.

10:19

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

This is not for that one. I don't think that one. I believe maybe something else which is, we don't know. Wrong people plan. Yeah. Wrong wait. Yeah. Maybe that one also. Or if we take out the vessel then we know what to say. Sorry, I don't understand. Sorry, what are you saying? If it is that captain, what do you call, in Singapore, Mr. Andre. Yeah, sir.

10:54

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

If it is a meal of Lord, then also, I said, suppose not to seek. It is not a meal of Lord. I have said, you know the, what you call, St. Quitter's Barth, to all the way to Antwerp.

11:18

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

with the ice break. Once I came out from the ice area and not see, my vessel turned to 17 degree laced. I have all the experience, I share everything with the master. That's it. But if there is anything goes beyond of this limit, immediately you just take out the vessel, go to other way like it.

12:08

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

I tried, but I was really, literally curious because we went for such a huge lunch and I was just curious because I love food so I'm always checking. No, no, it's just my curiosity. But otherwise, is it very busy these days or how we are doing? At the office here, is it very, very busy?

13:11

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

How many vessels are you managing now?

13:45

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

The two vessels belongs to one of the ventilator, the tanker vessel.

14:00

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

I don't think it is with you or something like that. Maybe you know the name of the vessel? Jarisha 1. Jarisha 2. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara Jarisha 1. Junara

14:49

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

No, they have four vessels. Two is continuous.

15:00

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

They are planning to go to, I think, Middle East. Then, I don't know, something wrong with that. They have small-span barges also. 2,000 vessels. Big owner, but they don't want to purchase the bigger vessel. Sir, they have maybe mother vessel also in Dubai. No, that is another company name.

15:24

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

They are very much cleverer than everyone. At least they are picking up the containers quite quickly now.

15:58

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

Well, we don't care about the ones that floated off, we care about the DGs and the Nurgles. From 14 DG cargoes we know where in Lebanon are. And unfortunately the Nurgles did float off, we don't know where they are. They're way beyond the seabed. When did the authorities find out there were Nurgles? Because it wasn't going to be revealed originally. Well, no, they actually went through the, they had the cargo manifesto. I know, but they hadn't picked it up. They realised after about two weeks or something that the ship had Nurgles on them.

16:43

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

One of the difficulties we have with this case with the Chinese salvage is trying to establish the tank and piping.

16:58

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

and ventilation system, because there are not ones. That's why before purchasing the vessel, they have already contract with all of you people. I said, you don't purchase the vessel, buy the glass vessels, so that you will get everything perfectly all right. Definitely everything should be there, but it is already in the car.

17:27

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

They should have still got the plan. Or maybe they don't want to be done.

17:36

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

It was on board the vessel. I think they made this one for the river buses in China. But then suddenly all the plants are not there. I had the full list.

18:09

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

But Tim was saying the ISM should require... No, no, they're supposed to send a short copy to us in our office, but they didn't say everything was on board. Only some selected copies they have sent.

18:28

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

we are supposed to make a coffee over here so we have made a plan so we will do it and we have some prepared job as well

18:40

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

Regrettable, because $160,000 a day... $185,000 on where it's working. Standby is $165,000. It cost a lot of money. We were trying to find out. And the Chinese, of course, were having to go down, and the divers were having to sort of work for themselves. I don't think they would do another one for this.

19:09

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

We didn't get to use it. I'm seeing we haven't found all the oil. It's probably in number two hole. What? The port side tank was supposed to have 53 tons. Oh, that's a lot still left on board. Is that a natural?

19:43

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

No, she's got a 7 degree list to port. Originally when she landed on the sea bed she was fairly flat. She was perfect.

20:00

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

When you see that it's soft, it's standard. It is the same model here in Chittagong and Paris also. Say when you do this, it will be submerged. Even more if you go down, yes. It has, it's sunk already. Yeah. After seven, eight years, you don't find the trace of the vessel. Yeah, definitely.

20:21

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

We'll tell the authorities that. That'll be fine. Yeah, the Chinese were saying they were having a problem getting under because it had sunk down on the port side. It had settled into the sand. Yeah, it was good. We're in Australia, isn't it? That's what our parents used to say. Did you ever get that? Yeah, I know that one. You dig on the beach. Yeah, yeah. So we're just waiting to see how the operation goes. So far with the BG cargoes, it's good.

20:53

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

They know where they are from when the Dutch-Belgian team went out right at the start of March when they went out with the sonar and the ROV. So they know exactly where they are. The problem is we don't know where they all are. And we searched a long area because as the ship went down it went astern and it left a stream of containers.

21:20

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

And it also left an anchor frame. So they searched all these areas. Not just around the ship, they searched all the areas. And there is quite a lot of containers scattered to the aft of the ship. The port sides go south-west in other words. So they also went down that region to check and they found more containers.

21:51

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

As it went down, they found an anchor trail on the seabend, so they could see where it had gone down.

22:07

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

And they supposed to wait over there and we are sourcing for local agent to get some container out to see what is going on, what was there. It was the plan, initially we made the plan on that project. We don't go there for sinking the vessel, right? No, no, no. It's just some container. Because of course once it goes down, it doesn't go down. It goes down to 3,000 tons, so it's just completely moving.

22:36

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

A long way from where it seems to be, from where it was on the surface. And there was this... At the start of the incident, fortunately, it was all south-west. Which meant, fortunately, the oil went offshore and all the containers that came off also went south-west. But there's a huge amount of containers missing. They're still in number two hole. That's still true. Closed inside the hole that you will get into the outside that is already gone. I believe that it's already gone down on the mark.

23:11

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

The trouble is explaining this to the authorities, because the authorities keep saying, get this, get this, lift this, they want everything done. It has been incredibly hard, because normally what I understand from team is that the authorities are not as difficult, but I understand that Thailand is kind of special team. The problem is, authorities are always strict wherever they are, but the Thai authorities will not take decisions.

23:43

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

Frightened to make decisions. We were dealing with like a... I don't know if you ever saw any of the team meetings in the special... What they did, they set up a special scene room there. It's a big hall. It's probably as large as the whole of your office. And it's got two or three tables, and they've got televisions, they've got screens. And I went into one of those meetings and I counted there were 28 people in there.

24:10

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

at the meeting they all had four stars or stripes they were all very senior people but of course none of them were taking the decision

24:18

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

We were saying, right, who's the decision maker? Who's going to say yes, no, you can do that, you can't do that? They will send everything to their head office. The head office will take a decision, then they will reply to you. I saw the Director General in Bangkok. I flew to Bangkok to meet the head of the Marine Department, the Director General. And I've been told that he has authorities to say yes or no. And then he said, no, no, I'm going to delegate this to Thailand. Because he don't understand as well, because he's from Maine. It's a great environment.

24:48

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

Yeah, Tide Neck was a special, it's like a Rambo group, they were set up to deal with international issues, border matters, drug smuggling, wrecks and damage.

25:00

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

So they've been involved with the Cambodians? It's a very special, they actually, they can report to the Prime Ministry. So they are members of various forces. So the DG of the Marine Department, we know, has authority to say yes or no, but he just passed it back to time. We've had this for weeks and weeks and weeks.

25:25

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

Because if someone took a decision and signed up on it, and something happened... Nobody wants to take the blame.

25:36

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

That's it, maybe it's difficult. Whereas other countries, they'll be very strict, they'll ask things you don't necessarily want. But you can get decisions from them. Lucky you are in Myanmar. We are in Myanmar. Oh, I'm finished. Don't think about anything. Why? No, Myanmar, Philippines, Vietnam, all of these countries. We have another, we have a rec removal in.

26:04

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

But my mind is very disorganized. And the other thing, of course, the authorities think they can do all these things themselves. They think they are experts. Okay, they have a lot of experienced people there. They have the Navy there.

26:20

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

You know, very experienced captains, but they have no idea. They've never done removing bunkers from 60 meters down. But even as I said, Parma maybe would have been more easier because everybody takes money. If it takes money, that is okay. The file is closed. They are not closing the file. If they take the money, go. That would have been more easier maybe.

26:45

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

We've got money talks there. Certainly quicker. It is. It's been very difficult and very, very expensive. And it still is. When do you think you'll have that conversation with the Thai authorities? It's been ongoing since the 7th of February. We've had to park it a little bit. We have parked it now. But we're trying to keep parking it basically. Exactly. I think the next phase will come on the onset of the monsoon season. And we're getting there another couple of weeks I think.

27:18

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

I don't know if you've had any news on when the monsoons might arrive or not. So if, say, these people, they take out the bunker, whatever they are, then after that, what? Well, I don't know. Let the ship stay there? No, what will happen, I suspect we know what will happen is, first of all, we have the Chinese there.

27:41

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

Costing a lot of money every day. We have been very clear with the authorities. We need to get the bunkers off. It's in your interest. We need to get the DG cargoes off. Now, once we've done that, let's have a reappraisal and see what we'll do. But the problem we've explained is that we'll be in the monsoon season.

27:59

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

And we can't really do any of these activities when we have the monsoon. It's dangerous. You're still talking about sending people down 50 meters underwater. And if you've got the boat on the surface, it's really quite dangerous. We want to get the Chinese away. In other words, do the DG cargoes and the oil. Get the Chinese out. Get the DG cargoes away. And then we'll look at what we've left with.

28:27

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

The position at the end of May, or sorry, the start of May, is going to be different in October if we go back down and have a look. As you yourself have said, we're going to have containers which have settled into the sea. The ship itself will have settled. So the authorities keep saying, remove everything, take it, take it, take it. And we've said, just a minute, let's wait. Let's deal with the important point first.

28:53

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

and then we'll have a look afterwards. As you said, many of the containers are missing. I don't think you'll find them again. No, no, no. Occasionally, as we have seen, the fishermen find them. Oh, okay. If it is floating. If it is floating, yeah.

29:12

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

I don't know if you saw the pictures of the ones that came up there. They're in good shape, actually. We had one yesterday, one today. I think we should send them to Bangladesh. And say, here's your cargo. They're actually... The containers look like...

29:33

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

They have been under water. No one knows inside? The drums are still inside. So what is the plan? Sending it to Malaysia or sending it to another? Well, we discussed this with the owners. We said, look, we don't know what to do. People want money only. People want money only. Second. People want money only. The competition. Nobody will accept that. They can have their cargo.

30:05

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

So, I discussed with others to what extent we can get some of these cargo ships found if they're ships necessary. I mean, we can take them to Malaysia. But for the DC cargo you cannot say. I mean, just simply pick my word. Why is that? You'll make another disaster over here. Especially for DC cargo. It might be a cheaper disaster. I don't think.

30:28

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

I don't think, because you had to wait for a long time to get the clearance from Bangladesh Navy. The same goes as Phuket over there, because all are from Navy.

30:42

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

and they don't know what is that, what to do. Even then, they don't think about what is the animal is it? There is some other kind here in Bangladesh that is not as far as the animal classes. They don't have even number or anything. But they say, no, it looks really different.

30:59

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

You understand? Then you have to wait for a long time. You have to discharge from churches and they have to wait to get the clearance and by this time, shipper has to pay the penalties for a long time. So that's the thing. Otherwise, it's okay. Once you can enter, then wait there. Otherwise, we have to dispose of them in Malaysia. That's also going to cost millions.

31:29

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

I wonder if there's any value some of the receivers might be inclined to take if they're not getting any cargo claims paid.

31:42

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

I mean, a lot of it's paper rolls, they will have gone. Paper rolls is not normally busy now, because it is already diseased. They're gone. They are gone. So, other than something like chemical, then we have to destroy. There is no other choice. Paper, you can go. No, when it's gone, it will have dissolved, let's say, after two months. But I was surprised the okay condition of the container. It wasn't deformed, it wasn't twisted, it was straight.

32:13

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

Only thing is that if the water went inside, that is the... Containers are nothing. They're two, three thousand dollars anyway. The value of the containers... The reason we were concerned about the container is that it's holding its integrity. In other words, it's not going to fall apart. That was good news. They're obviously putting containers in the cradle to lift them out.

32:40

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

So there's no distortion. It's good to see that the containers are intact and look okay. In other words, they're not going to fall apart. It has sufficient strength to withstand the 50 meters pressure on there. Good quality. I would say good quality vessel as well. If you see the painting on the vessel, it looks nice still.

33:09

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

We just, you know, make it ready for, you know, and I and Mahmoud, they start looking for second, third deciliter. All gone. Anyway, gentlemen, we want to say thank you for seeing us. A big thank you to Tim's. I'll just go to the toilet. Cheers, cheers. That's all the traffic on the way back. We could be some time in the car. Yes.

33:45

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

No, each other. There will be another one.

34:21

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

not onerous, but we are incredibly lucky. You don't mention it in front of Tim, but just so you're aware, if you get it again, with this being a requirement from the pre-attachment P&I survey, you have to comply. We have chased and chased and chased the confirmation, and it hadn't come in.

34:44

S… Speaker 2 (Recording_154)

And then she's saying, so we are very, very happy.

35:17

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

Anyone else leave the bathroom before we head off? Captain, we'll have to move. We have BSC coming for dinner at 7.

35:34

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

We had a meeting with BSC, and then we had lunch with Bangor, and then we had a meeting with Abul Paya, and then BSC and Commodore coming for dinner this evening. That's it. Next time, if you come here, there will be another one for the meeting. There is one discussion that is going on. We want to process to continue the session. That's it. If we can make it. InshaAllah. But we have full session.

36:00

S… Speaker 1 (Recording_154)

We have a pre-dinner meeting to discuss two things with the AC and they're coming in 40 minutes. It's earlier. Yeah. So we need to go. Yeah. Thank you for your hospitality.

བཅུད་དོན་

དྲན་ཤེས་ལ་དྲི་བ་དྲིས་ལན་ཞུ།